1.6% of the North American population says, “We can’t explain how or why:
. There is a life sustaining universe.
. There are a hundred plus exquisitely finely tuned constants and qualities that were in place at Planck time, allowing for this universe to exist.
. There are laws of logic and mathematics.
. There are objective morals, values and obligations.
. Each cell contains the most specifically complex coded information ever discovered.
. Life emerged from inorganic gases.
So we’ll go with the best scientific explanation that we’ve got - “Chance did it. No, better than that, chance plus lots and lots and lots of time did it.”
Problem - time and chance are just words. Words don’t do anything.
It's atheism of the gaps.
Even though these people say that without observation and verification nothing can be believed these people must maintain this implausible position or their belief system will collapse.
That’s what these people are like. It’s how they think.
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There are answers to some of the things you've listed, but I suspect you're not interested in reading them. Instead, I'll ask the following:
ReplyDeleteWhat's wrong with not having a complete explanation for things? Why is having an answer more important than having the correct answer?
Incidentally, it's sad to see you go right back to lying about people.
Can someone explain to me how a person can write a comment like this:
ReplyDelete...Are you saying that Adam and Eve never had the choice to say “yes” to obedience?...
and a blog post that include this:
Each cell contains the most specifically complex coded information ever discovered.
???
The Logical obsurdity in infinite power is not being understood, so I'm going to explain this in the simplest way I can...
ReplyDeleteYou cannot say that god did "the best he can" unless god is limited in what he can do. A "best" can only work when there are limits. This is because with infinity there can always be "better". Just like there can always be a bigger number. You do not have a "final" number and likewise not a "best" thing, unless god operates under limitations. If god is limited, he's not unlimited.
If god is limited, then how is he god?
If god is unlimited, then it follows that he intentionally designed a reality with suffering even though he didn't have to, to achieve the results he wanted.
We cannot say god put limits on himself, because he had to have done so being unlimited and therefore he's never limited.
Let me illustrate the nature of god with mathematics...
ReplyDeleteIf I say pick a random number from zero to infinity could you do it?
No. Randomization requires defined limits to assign a probability to the possible outcomes. Randomization cannot exist without probability. And probability cannot exist in infinity.
So you say "well, how about the number 667,354,198? I could have picked ANY number?"
No, You could not. Your finite mind cannot render infinite data. Your limited by not only your finite knowledge of numbers but your finite mind itself. Numbers themselves represent a finite idea or value. No number reaches infinity.
So, if god is infinite, how do we determine what "number" best describes his character? The bible will try to describe an infinite being, but with what? How can we, as finite agents, describe something infinite? A character represents a finite idea. It is a random number determined by a finite range of possibilities.
Unless god is limited, he cannot have a "character" or "nature."
we therefore cannot attribute any design to his character. He cannot hold any values or definitions. Not if he's infinite.
"It's atheism of the gaps."
ReplyDeleteThat phrase doesn't make sense.
Anyway, enjoy believing in magic, kid.
WEM said.."Incidentally, it's sad to see you go right back to lying about people."
ReplyDeleteYeah i know ..The man is obviously slow of mind and dull of thought.
Because he will allow himself to be such a blatant liar and bigot.
And then go and try suggesting how stupid it is i dont bother with faith, only due to observing my own cult families downfalls.
Dont you get it Mak ...Its actually got very little to do with what i observe about my family ...And lots more!! to do with me ALSO observing your disgusting ignorant thoughtless actions! and the popes! same type actions, and most every faith bigots same type actions!,that ive ever seen heard or met.
It just become so very very obvious!, faith is obviously poison to almost everyone! Mak
Do ya finally get it?.
Add to the fact it seems like its really such nasty poison, the other fact that we also see absolutely none! good evidence of any god either !.
And its obviously got little to do with my own cult family at all, now has it Mak.So why lie about it Mak?...You the only one acting like a spastic
Now i know you pridefully like to think maybe your faith has made you something wonderful.
But let me break it to ya Mak.
Its actually become more and more obvious!, as times gone by with reading this blog....That ive seen obviously your faith has actually turned you into a right ignorant thoughtless bigoted prick! Mak .
Now how much was it, you said my own family was all that was ever involved in my decisions again?.
Do you manage to actually understand my position any better now?.
Do you get it now ...I actually see little difference between my familys actions and your actions or even the Popes actions Mak.
What reason then should i have to even think faith is of any honest benefit?.
The only effect i see it honestly has, is the effect of poisoning people who swallow it.
"Problem - time and chance are just words. Words don’t do anything"
ReplyDeleteWrong.They are not just words Mak, they are words used to discribe a certain type of actions/happenings
Time = is a word used as a way of measurement of a certain period of moments within this universe.
Chance = is a word used for descibing things that happen with random effect
Arguing by suggesting words are just words,is really just another pointless word game Mak.
And you even know its actually far from being so very honest
"Even though these people say that without observation and verification nothing can be believed these people must maintain this implausible position or their belief system will collapse."
ReplyDeleteOh yeah lets see.
1,We happen to observe absolutely no good evidence at all "so far" for likelhood of any God-/s.
2, Though yet we still lack understanding of many of the hows and whys, so far all evidence we see seems to point towards something natural .And nothing supernatural.
So far we have the choice of choosing between that we so far... see more evidence for (natural). Or that what we so far.... see absolutely no evidence yet for (supernatural).
Mak faithman feels maybe it might be smarter? if we simply went and chose trialing that what we see absolutely no evidence for (supernatural)
Thats real faith for ya...That’s what these people are like. It’s how they think.
So then... is it really any real wonder? that in the past history! these fine folks of faith guess work! ,also already SIMPLY went ahead! and "trialed"! human sacrifice! ,animal sacrifice!, burning babies in fire!,refusing blood tranfusions! etc etc ...All these things of FAITH .All which had absolutely no evidence for proof of actually honestly working ...No see... it was faith science
They dont care if no evidence is available ...Faith equals trial and so far error! after error! after error!
That’s what these people are like. It’s how they think.
They dont even SEEM to care how much faith has already hurt and harmed and even killed people.
No not really.Not honestly anyway.
And then they will still try palming off on us, that evidently.... yes Jesus loves us
Pffttttt ..Loves making life more of a prick than really ever need be..... if people only decided to first be sure! to look! for much more evidence! for proof!.... before they simply went ahead with trialing faiths
By the way, 'Snackbar, I really loved your above post IRT probability & infinites. I'd never really considered the need for boundaries, but it makes sense...
ReplyDelete